Comments on: Don't Confuse "Green" with "Clean"

By: Greg

Greg — Tue, 17 Jun 2008 07:14:46 +0000

Green is already the most overused word in the English language. It means nothing anymore. As far as cars go, I don’t buy them to be Green, I will buy them to save money on fuel. With propane tripling in cost within the last few years I will be burning wood again this winter. It is the cost “stupid”. Yeah, there is an old saying “waste not, want not”. It is a good way to be, but it does not mean I think green. It just means I am not wasteful. I’ll burn coal in a “New York Minute” if it will save me money.

By: AME

AME — Mon, 16 Jun 2008 14:03:41 +0000

Some car reviews websites have shown that diesel is as green and clean as electric precisely because of the enviromental toll mining for nickel, and the manufacturing a single battery creates.

By: 6FTRABBIT

6FTRABBIT — Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:48:43 +0000

When it comes to energy, just like the bumper sticker says: “There are no free rides. Put out or get out.”

By: dlf

dlf — Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:47:57 +0000

What a silly article. It makes some good points but a Prius sitting in traffic has zero emissions and a hummer spews massive amounts of pollution that contribute to pre-mature respiratory deaths (40,000 per year) and climate changing.
Beware of green-hype, but embrace great new products and technology that help us to move from our sinfully wasteful lifestyles. I’ll carefully use CFLs until LEDs become a best option (soon) and my next car will certainly be a hybrid. I’ll never buy another “conventional” auto again.

By: Kerry

Kerry — Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:41:59 +0000

I’m sure the energy saved over the life of a CFL pays for the cost of production AND recycling of 2 plastic bags. Also, using a CFL bulb greatly reduces exposure to mercury. Incandescent lightbulbs use 4-5 times more energy than CFL bulbs. Where does that energy come from? Probably a coal plant. Coal has mercury in it, and when coal is burned, that mercury ends up in our air, soil, and water. By using a CFL bulb over it’s lifetime, you’re reducing coal output by 80%. That little drop of coal in your CFL doesn’t compare to what an incandescent bulb puts out in the environment.

Also, does this guy take into account the cost of shipping and refining oil? It’s analogous to the CFL example. The Prius has about 3 to 4x the fuel economy of a Hummer. That means running a Prius over it’s lifetime requires 25-35% of the fuel that a Hummer uses. That also means you only need to ship and refine 25-35% of the fuel to run a Prius compared to a Hummer. I’m not making any claims for this case, but the drastic reduction in fuel usage and the energy to drill and refine that fuel should offset the Prius’s net energy costs a bit.

Why is it that Americans are so scared of upfront costs? Just because CFLs cost more upfront doesn’t mean it won’t save you in the long run. Same with the Prius. I bet it would be the case for the total energy use. Maybe a Prius does cost more energy to produce. But when you actually drive the damn thing, you’ll still be saving a ton of energy.

I’m not sure if I agree with David. The costs of building an alternative energy infrastructure probably follows the aforementioned pattern. Yes, solar cells require energy to be produced, but when you use them, they are pretty much free (no mining, drilling, refining, shipping, burning). Nuclear plants can also be surprisingly inefficient. We must remember that nearly all energy used in nature comes from the sun. Even wind is caused by uneven heating of earth’s surface, which is caused by…the sun! I’m thinking we should listen to nature and her magnificent designs. Solar and wind energy are the obvious answers. Biofuels, if made efficiently and doesn’t use food crops (hopefully use more algae in the future) are a possibility as well.

Yes, I understand fossil fuels come from the sun as well. But I don’t see any other living creatures using coal for energy..

Kerry
Plano, Driving-huge-gas-guzzling-SUVs-on-perfectly-flat-paved-roads-Texas

By: Ken

Ken — Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:14:29 +0000

Isn’t it funny that no one was concerned about mercury in fluorescent lamps until the CFLs came out? Mercury is in ALL fluorescent lamps. The amount in the bulb is tiny, and the massive energy savings are well worth the tiny risk. Just like anything made of glass… it’s best not to drop it in the first place. When they eventually do burn out, take them to your household hazerdous waste site along with your used batteries.

By: David W

David W — Fri, 13 Jun 2008 18:46:29 +0000

“One study actually found that because of this, its actually nearly as ‘green’ to buy a Hummer than a Prius!”

Yes. One study that has been thoroughly debunked. One assumption that study makes is that a Hummer will drive 3x farther than a Prius in its life and will therefore cost much less per mile driven to manufacture. Toyota built the Prius to go a long way in its life. In fact due to regenerative braking and CVT it is mechanically a lot less complex than a Hummer so will likely last a lot longer and cost a lot less in maintenance.

Another failing of that study is the use in it of 30 year old emissions data from Sudbury’s Nickel mine. Toyota didn’t buy the Nickel 30 years ago. The emissions from the mine have been severely curtailed by today’s environmental legislation.

The authors of the study (CNW) are known to have big three affiliation so their objectivity is questionable. I’d expect better from Fox. I guess I’d be wrong there.

By: David

David — Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:43:17 +0000

Who is this guy kidding about clean energy. Does he have any idea how much energy goes into manufacturing, distributing and installing solar and wind generation. Not to include the routine maintenance of wind generation that is almost always on dirt roads serviced buy gas burning vehicles. It takes many years just to cover their own carbon footprint before they start reducing the one they are replacing. The reason gas, coal and natural gas are so widely used is that they are the most efficient and enviromentally friendly forms of power we have, when used correctly. Nuclear would be the best for electrical but the uninformed and Hollywood have killed that one.

David
Redding California